2020-2021 ROSTER TALK: Archived - Printable Version +- MavsBoard (https://www.mavsboard.com) +-- Forum: Boards (https://www.mavsboard.com/forumdisplay.php?fid=1) +--- Forum: Dallas Mavericks and the NBA (https://www.mavsboard.com/forumdisplay.php?fid=2) +--- Thread: 2020-2021 ROSTER TALK: Archived (/showthread.php?tid=682) Pages:
1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
27
28
29
30
31
32
33
34
35
36
37
38
39
40
41
42
43
44
45
46
47
48
49
50
51
52
53
54
55
56
57
58
59
60
61
62
63
64
65
66
67
68
69
70
71
72
73
74
75
76
77
78
79
80
81
82
83
84
85
86
87
88
89
90
91
92
93
94
95
96
97
98
99
100
101
102
103
104
105
106
107
108
109
110
111
112
113
114
115
116
117
118
119
120
121
122
123
124
125
126
127
128
129
130
131
132
133
134
135
136
137
138
139
140
141
142
143
144
145
146
147
148
149
150
151
152
153
154
155
156
157
158
159
160
161
162
163
164
165
166
167
168
169
170
171
172
173
174
175
176
177
178
179
180
181
182
183
184
185
186
187
188
189
190
191
192
193
194
195
196
197
198
199
200
201
202
203
204
205
206
207
208
209
210
211
212
213
214
215
216
217
218
219
220
221
222
223
224
225
226
227
228
229
230
231
232
233
234
235
236
237
238
239
240
241
242
243
244
245
246
247
248
249
250
251
252
253
254
255
256
257
258
259
260
261
262
263
264
265
266
267
268
269
270
271
272
273
274
275
276
277
278
279
280
281
282
283
284
285
286
287
288
289
290
291
292
293
294
295
296
297
298
299
300
301
302
303
304
305
306
307
308
309
310
311
312
313
314
315
316
317
318
319
320
321
322
323
324
325
326
327
328
329
330
331
332
333
334
335
336
337
338
339
340
341
342
343
344
345
346
347
348
349
350
351
352
353
354
355
356
357
358
359
360
361
362
363
364
365
366
367
368
369
370
371
372
373
374
375
376
377
378
379
380
381
382
383
384
385
386
387
388
389
390
391
392
393
394
395
396
397
398
399
400
401
402
403
404
405
406
407
408
409
410
411
412
413
414
415
416
417
418
419
420
421
422
423
424
425
426
427
428
429
430
431
432
433
434
435
436
437
438
439
440
441
442
443
444
445
446
447
448
449
450
451
452
453
454
455
456
457
458
459
460
461
462
463
464
465
466
467
468
469
470
471
472
473
474
475
476
477
478
479
480
|
RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - Omega_Supreme - 05-29-2021 (05-29-2021, 09:09 PM)Branduil Wrote: If Lavine wants to play with Luka, he has the power to do that. We need Luka to get in his buddies' ear. Houston didn't want the shitty return they got for Harden but he was still able to force a trade... Lavine would actually have more leverage since he's on the final year of his contract. This 100% and I am not sure why there is not a unanimous agreement on this. Lavine is the most realistic and best option given the agent connection and him being on the last year of his contract. He is the perfect fit to Luka as he is everything that Luka is not (Athletic, quick, explosive) while still being a legit ISO scorer just like Luka that can be a secondary playmaker when needed. The biggest thing lost in the Curry trade was that Curry could score unassisted and was a bail out option when Luka was being heavily focused. As you said yes I think we can get Lavine for nothing and we may be able to get Thaddeus Young as well. I will happily do something like this Chicago Receives Buddy Hield Delon Wright Tyrell Terry 2 1st round picks 2 2nd round picks Dallas Receives Laure Markkenen (Sign and Trade) Zach Lavine Sacramento Receives Kristaps Porzingis The hope is that Duffy can be of some help here but he has 2 guys on that team in Vucevic and Lavine so who knows. You could see something like this or you could see a three way trade with a team like Sacramento involved. KP will definitely be traded RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - cjeter24 - 05-29-2021 (05-29-2021, 01:07 PM)Mavs2021 Wrote: That´s what I always think, when people moan about Lauri´s defense. Didn't realize the Knicks were one of the best FO in the league lol. I think they are better now but I don't believe that FO was there when we made the deal either. RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - ClutchDirk - 05-29-2021 (05-29-2021, 09:20 PM)Omega_Supreme Wrote: This 100% and I am not sure why there is not a unanimous agreement on this. As one of the last KP supporters I would do this trade if he indeed wants out or does not play hard this playoff run... RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - StepBackJay - 05-29-2021 (05-29-2021, 09:09 PM)Branduil Wrote: If Lavine wants to play with Luka, he has the power to do that. We need Luka to get in his buddies' ear. Houston didn't want the shitty return they got for Harden but he was still able to force a trade... Lavine would actually have more leverage since he's on the final year of his contract. Is LaVine the type to demand a trade? I have no idea. His situation is pretty fascinating. I don't see him forcing a trade but who knows. I do think it's an issue that Mavs don't really have anything the Bulls would care about. RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - cjeter24 - 05-29-2021 Regarding Lavine I don't think he's going to be Supermax eligible based on how brutal the guard competition is for those triggers and how he's always on bad teams. So the financial incentive to stay is much lower than Beal. I've been wanting Lavine here for a loooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooong time. So I'm all about that. I was saying we should try and sign him as an RFA. Bulls originally got killed on that deal and I said I would have paid him more. He's such a gifted scorer. I'm glad he's finally showed what he's capable of. I've had a suspicion for a while that the Mavs have been planning to go into 2022 FA with cap space to try sign Beal/Lavine barring a star falling into their lap. They seem to keep hyping Luka as an attraction and want one more shot at getting someone to come play. Lavine might be that guy next summer. RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - cjeter24 - 05-29-2021 (05-29-2021, 09:31 PM)ClutchDirk Wrote: As one of the last KP supporters I would do this trade if he indeed wants out or does not play hard this playoff run... Even if I thought KP could be a true #2, I'm doing this trade. What we've seen from Lavine he'd be an absolute monster here and be able to be the secondary ball handler we clearly need in our lineups. He's an absolute dream backcourt partner with Luka except the defense will be fairly suspect. Who cares tho? They may both score 30ppg haha. RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - ClutchDirk - 05-29-2021 (05-29-2021, 09:40 PM)cjeter24 Wrote: Even if I thought KP could be a true #2, I'm doing this trade. What we've seen from Lavine he'd be an absolute monster here and be able to be the secondary ball handler we clearly need in our lineups. He's an absolute dream backcourt partner with Luka except the defense will be fairly suspect. I wanted LM during the draft that year...him and Lavine would be a good combo to have... RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - StepBackJay - 05-29-2021 I like these trades that will pair KP with Vucevic bc that's a front court the Bulls are dying to put together. Also I wonder if Bulls offered the Vuc package to the Mavs at the TDL? RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - StepBackJay - 05-29-2021 I wonder if Mavs could have gotten WCJ, OPJ and two first round picks for KP. RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - Aussiebballer - 05-29-2021 If you expect the Mavs to have cap space in 2022 then expect a big drop off next season. That would require dumping KP for draft assets and/or not resigning THJ. Luka’s extension will kick in in the 2022 offseason and will take up a big chunk of the salary cap. RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - Branduil - 05-29-2021 The main thing with Lavine is I would say you need to put as many defenders around him and Luka as possible since neither guy is known for defense. Still easier to hide a long, tall guard than a 7'2" traffic cone center though. I think you would probably have to add Brunson for Chicago- they need a PG, and Brunson would lose minutes with Luka/Lavine/THJ here anyway. I would only take Markennen if Lavine+Markennen adds up to a few million less than what we send out. As long as we got rid of JRich we could then target Holmes and re-sign THJ with the rest of cap space. Mavs would also have to add a cheap backup PG with the room exception... since we could have one of Luka/Lavine out at all times it could just be some solid veteran. Luka / Vet PG Lavine /THJ / Burke DFS / Green Maxi / Markennen Holmes / WCS / Powell RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - cjeter24 - 05-29-2021 (05-29-2021, 09:45 PM)Aussiebballer Wrote: If you expect the Mavs to have cap space in 2022 then expect a big drop off next season. That would require dumping KP for draft assets and/or not resigning THJ. We only have 63 mill on the books so far in 2022 not counting cap holds or THJ. 27.5 of that is all expiring deals or an option we can decline (josh green). Powell is 11 of that sadly but Kleber's deal is non guaranteed. so almost 20 mill you could wipe without even "dumping" a contract. Luka's max will kick in but Luka had a massive cap hold anyways. I want to say the cap difference of waiting to sign him is like somewhere between 10-15 mill. It's significant but not something you couldn't compensate for by moving other players. I mean it'll be pretty dang clear this summer whether the Mavs are going to keep flexibility open for next summer. RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - Aussiebballer - 05-29-2021 They could roll the cap space over another year but it would sacrifice improvement and potentially pissing Luka off. They have to communicate very clearly with Luka and his agent the next 2 years as keeping him happy and impressed with the way the team is moving is massively important. There is no guarantee Luka will be like Dirk, he could rapidly turn into Lebron or KD if he doesn’t think the Mavs can build him title contenting teams. And no one season 10 years ago won’t impress him. Effectively wasting 3 offseasons is an easy way to disillusioning your star player. RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - cjeter24 - 05-29-2021 (05-29-2021, 10:03 PM)Aussiebballer Wrote: They could roll the cap space over another year but it would sacrifice improvement and potentially pissing Luka off. They have to communicate very clearly with Luka and his agent the next 2 years as keeping him happy and impressed with the way the team is moving is massively important. It's an unpopular opinion but I think the Mavs have played the last few years EXTREMELY well. They did not look themselves into a roster (*cough cough clippers) and have managed to find some good players. They know what type of players work well with Luka and some that don't. We complain about the lack of assets... But after this year we only owe a single 1st to anyone and own the rest. We don't have top end assets but we have plenty of players that we have been able to accumulate that do have decent value. Over the next 2 years, our asset pool will continue to widen as we get closer to 2023 and get all of our picks back + the young player development we already have AND we will have at least the ability to have cap space barring making a big trade or FA signing before then. We haven't wasted any offseason yet IMO. We haven't added a major piece yet but we have added some good players and than added a bunch of young talent. we haven't been able to see their progression with a proper offseason with the team. Mavs have gotten better each of the last few years. It's slow but it's not wasting an offseason. They'll improve this offseason too. RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - KillerLeft - 05-29-2021 (05-29-2021, 10:26 PM)cjeter24 Wrote: It's an unpopular opinion but I think the Mavs have played the last few years EXTREMELY well. I agree...right up to the point where they max extended a guy they weren't sure was a fit yet. RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - Aussiebballer - 05-29-2021 Have to disagree the only reason the Mavs have gotten better is due to existing assets improving, ie Luka, DFS and the KP tax THJ. They haven’t used the offseason to add anything to the team. Not signing anyone to a bad deal is a pretty low bar for a front office and unacceptable if they intend to play for a title in the next 5 years. RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - cjeter24 - 05-29-2021 I mean we get to much doom and gloom around here but I don't think you guys realize how good of a spot the Mavs are in right now. Moving forward they have a top 5 player in the league, a good team around him (albeit no 2nd star), cap space atm, all but 1 draft pick moving forward, some young players with upside that may turn into a better asset, and most importantly an owner willing to spend money and do whatever it takes to win. And Carlisle is a well respected coach no matter what you think about him. Now they have to execute and find a way to make all that fit together into a championship quality team. RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - cjeter24 - 05-29-2021 (05-29-2021, 10:34 PM)Aussiebballer Wrote: Have to disagree the only reason the Mavs have gotten better is due to existing assets improving, ie Luka, DFS and the KP tax THJ. They resigned all of their own guys (including KP), signed curry and flipped him for a solid draft pick and Richardson. That's the last 2 offseasons. It's really not new additions but resigning your own guys you acquired is important and you have seen just how important with DFS and Kleber this year. Also context for last year, Mavs didn't have actual cap space. And they chose not to spend assets to create the cap space. Additionally the thing I like most about the last few offseasons for the Mavs is that they clearly have a vision for the team. Defenders who can shoot. Those guys are highly sought after and unfortunately Mavs didn't close the deal. Criticize away on that. But they also didn't panic and screw up future plans. Sometimes the best moves you make are the ones you don't. We've shown that repeatedly with these free agents we went after that flopped. Honestly it seems like their is curse on FAs that spurn us. They flame out shortly after haha. RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - Branduil - 05-29-2021 The 2019 offseason is really indefensible at this point. The only good addition was Curry and we traded him away for a bad player. We could have easily added a legit guard like Brogdon that offseason but Cuban thought he was being clever by signing a "cheaper" version in Delon Wright. RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL with $22.7M - $34.4M in capspace | FA starts Aug 2, 5 pm - cjeter24 - 05-29-2021 (05-29-2021, 10:31 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: I agree...right up to the point where they max extended a guy they weren't sure was a fit yet. Did they have an option? He was a talented RFA and former all star. He was getting maxed whether we resigned him or not. It hasn't been the best signing for sure. But RFA tends to be like that with guys getting bloated contracts that aren't worth it. I think it's been a trend for a long time now because someone wants to find the next Steph Curry as an RFA. Remember he got a super cheap RFA contract with GS below his max and before his jump/new cba. Also Harden, same thing. I find it interesting how frustrated you all are with KP. He's not a great defender and puts up some absolute stinker of games at times but also can put up some big ones. That same description describes Hardaway who everyone seems to be willing to pay alot of money to bring back. That's bad value for KP's deal for sure. But I don't think he'd be viewed any differently if he was making 20 mill around here. |