(03-31-2021, 02:39 PM)omahen Wrote: Luka, McConell,      Terry
JRich, THJ,            Green
OPJ, DFS,              Hinton
Maxi,                     Bey
KP, Theis,              WCS (or let him walk and sign someone else)

I think we get very, very tough defensively with TJ and Theis. We get secondary playmaking with TJ. We get shooting with OPJ. Not flashy but it might work very well.

(04-01-2021, 04:14 PM)mvossman Wrote: Based on your posts, I am guessing you are going to hate this, but I kind of like the idea of offering him an extension.  I think the max we can offer him is something like 13?  I think he has had a down year shooting, and had some lingering struggles with the whole Covid thing.  He has been disappointing, but an extension at that price would be buying low.

(04-01-2021, 08:24 PM)cow Wrote: Hate is probably too strong of a word.  Buy low might be too strong of a descriptor for that type of contract.  A contract in that range might just be what he is worth, the guy is 28 and a six year veteran.  His three point shooting will probably bounce back as these seems like a down year but his 2PT and FT % should probably return to the norm as well.  He shows defensive flashes and is decent enough with the ball against average defenders to get shots up.  While I don't really want to be the team that pays him, he just needs to be easily moveable and based around all the tea leaves we saw coming into the TDL, he wasn't a very desirable expiring.  Granted we are only privy to NBA reporting and NBA twitter but I don't remember any grumblings about him.  

I guess the question I keep asking is, "has he made the team any better this year"?

(04-01-2021, 05:57 PM)StepBackJay Wrote: Mavs do not have a first round pick but doesn't mean they couldn't get one. I think the Brogdan deal isn't a bad comp. Pacers gave up a first round pick and two seconds plus a 20 mil/yr contract in that S&T deal. Mavs have Brunson plus a few young players and I think Maxi could fetch a pick. At any rate I do expect Mavs to try to make a Collins deal happen. I bet this is their plan A.

(04-01-2021, 08:56 PM)Kammrath Wrote: Once the draft passes and the Knicks get the 2021 pick, don't the Mavs then acquire the ability to trade a pick again pretty easy?

(04-01-2021, 08:47 PM)mvossman Wrote: To me, the real question is, what is the likelihood of him making the team better in the future.  I think we are seeing his floor right now  for various reasons (luck, Covid, new team, etc).  He is not what we are looking for as a secondary creator and he is not a lock down defender.  He is a guy that can provide some versatility on offense (not great but better than DFS or Maxi) and he is currently the only quality defender we have that can handle 1s (as well as wings on switches).  He is a proven legit starter on quality teams, which is something we are in short supply of.  He is prolly worth roughly 15 a year, so at 13 a year he is a legit asset (due to the scarcity of quality starters).  A big part of this is that I think we are better off operating over the cap, in which case we are better off re-signing him and THJ.  I think there are limited/unlikely scenarios where operating under the cap will actually improve the team we currently have.

(04-02-2021, 04:02 AM)cow Wrote: 2021 is unprotected.  2023 is top 10 protected through 2025.  Without removing the protections, I believe the earliest FRP the Mavs can trade is 2027.  If they removed the protections (don't do this), that would bump the pick to 2025.  I would think for a S&T, the other team is going to want that pick to come before 2027 and maybe before 2025.  You'd probably need to figure out a way to get a FRP from someone else which means sending out Jalen or Maxi.  I guess you could add KP to that list of names but that really starts to complicate things.

(04-01-2021, 08:56 PM)Kammrath Wrote: I hope this is their plan A, it would definitely be mine. A 23 year old budding star? Got to take your shot IMO. 

Once the draft passes and the Knicks get the 2021 pick, don't the Mavs then acquire the ability to trade a pick again pretty easy?

I am also 100% with you that getting JC puts the Mavs in a MUCH better asset situation moving forward. I think Luka and maturity will make JC of this summer nothing compared to what he would be worth in another summer or two.

(04-02-2021, 04:02 AM)cow Wrote: 2021 is unprotected.  2023 is top 10 protected through 2025.  Without removing the protections, I believe the earliest FRP the Mavs can trade is 2027.  If they removed the protections (don't do this), that would bump the pick to 2025.  I would think for a S&T, the other team is going to want that pick to come before 2027 and maybe before 2025.  You'd probably need to figure out a way to get a FRP from someone else which means sending out Jalen or Maxi.  I guess you could add KP to that list of names but that really starts to complicate things.

(04-02-2021, 04:02 AM)cow Wrote: 2021 is unprotected.  2023 is top 10 protected through 2025.  Without removing the protections, I believe the earliest FRP the Mavs can trade is 2027.  If they removed the protections (don't do this), that would bump the pick to 2025.  I would think for a S&T, the other team is going to want that pick to come before 2027 and maybe before 2025.  You'd probably need to figure out a way to get a FRP from someone else which means sending out Jalen or Maxi.  I guess you could add KP to that list of names but that really starts to complicate things.

(04-02-2021, 06:13 AM)Mavs2021 Wrote: Since all picks recently traded go up to 2027, so I assume you can include picks until 2028 after the next draft. I think it won´t take a lot of convincing to offer the Knicks a swap of 2023 top 10 protected for 2022 unprotected.

In that case we certainly have the assets to pull off trades for Collins and Lavine, but then we are truly empty with

Doncic/Brunson
Lavine/Richardson
DFS/X
Collins/Bey
Porzingis/X

(04-02-2021, 06:13 AM)Mavs2021 Wrote: Since all picks recently traded go up to 2027, so I assume you can include picks until 2028 after the next draft. I think it won´t take a lot of convincing to offer the Knicks a swap of 2023 top 10 protected for 2022 unprotected.

In that case we certainly have the assets to pull off trades for Collins and Lavine, but then we are truly empty with

Doncic/Brunson
Lavine/Richardson
DFS/X
Collins/Bey
Porzingis/X

(04-02-2021, 08:44 AM)Branduil Wrote: I keep going back to OKC as potential destination for KP in a trade. Mainly because they have a mountain of picks and the cap space next offseason to just absorb KP outright(and then some).

So if the Mavs could convince Collins to sign with us, they could do something like trading KP and Powell to OKC, who then sends 1 first back to us and Bazley and 2 firsts to Atlanta, and Atlanta sends Collins.

With this trade, if JRich opted out then the Mavs would end up with something close to $45 million in cap space in addition to Collins. That's more than enough to re-sign THJ and also pursue other targets.

(04-01-2021, 07:22 PM)StepBackJay Wrote: A couple issues Dan w/this approach:

1. The middle class of guys who are bubble starters are also hard to get. You may want Ibaka or Harrell but you wind up with WCS and Burke. You might want Danny Green but you get Delon Wright. That being said this is for sure the Mavs backup plan because what else are they going to do? They have 5 of their top 7 players under contract and 25-37 or whatever million dollars in cap space so I think they put together a team even if they strike out on their "big fish" (which evidently is Collins).

(04-02-2021, 08:52 AM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: I don't think the issue is how hard it is to get the middle class.  I think the issue is the middle class is always Plan B while we chase the bigger fish first.  Note the three guys in your example all went to LA.  Players have 29 other choices and sometimes the other choices are more attractive.  That's a fact of life, not a failing of the MBT.  Who doesn't want to win a ring with Lebron?

Maybe we should stop trying to be LA and do what Indy did the moment free agency opened with Brogdon or what Utah did the moment free agency opened with Bogdonovic or what Charlotte did the moment free agency opened with Hayward.  Make those guys Plan A.  Atlanta used $37 million in space last summer to get Gallinari AND Bogdonovic.  Do that rather than waiting around on a 1% chance Kawhi picks us.  We can debate who that is in 2021, but it is the team's job to know who would jump at the chance to be here and who might have us further down their list.  

I don't see a path to Collins.  My interest in him was at the TDL when you could hold his matching rights.  I see a huge issue with trying to work this out with Atlanta while other names are flying off the board (we know how that movie ends).  I'm also not sure we would be Collins' first choice.  I get why a Dallas-centric community would think playing next to Luka and KP is perfect for any player.  However, if I am his agent, my main job is to get the most I can get now and set him up for the next contract.  I'd much rather place him where he would be first or second fiddle rather than third.  That way he's got a much better shot at a five year 7-9 max money deal the next time.

A great example of this is Christian Wood.  We sent Detroit more than enough salary to match Wood and pretty clearly they preferred Wright over Ariza.  The rest of the deal with Houston wasn't hard to replicate.  My takeaway isn't that the MBT failed.  My takeaway is Wood saw a bigger role (and greater future riches) in Houston.  Crowder said the same thing about Phoenix.    

We can debate the specific names.  You don't like Monk, what about Norman Powell or DeRozan or Fournier or Duncan Robinson or Dinwiddie.  I don't think it will be hard to replace what THJ does.  Just because the team says they will be "aggressive" (which they say every year), it doesn't mean they are going to strictly look at Max guys.  What I'm advocating is making your target(s) guys that are realistic and getting that done at 5:01 like other teams in similar markets seem to be able to do.

(04-02-2021, 08:52 AM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: Maybe we should stop trying to be LA and do what Indy did the moment free agency opened with Brogdon or what Utah did the moment free agency opened with Bogdonovic or what Charlotte did the moment free agency opened with Hayward.  Make those guys Plan A.  Atlanta used $37 million in space last summer to get Gallinari AND Bogdonovic.  Do that rather than waiting around on a 1% chance Kawhi picks us.  We can debate who that is in 2021, but it is the team's job to know who would jump at the chance to be here and who might have us further down their list.  

I don't see a path to Collins.  My interest in him was at the TDL when you could hold his matching rights.  I see a huge issue with trying to work this out with Atlanta while other names are flying off the board (we know how that movie ends).  I'm also not sure we would be Collins' first choice.  I get why a Dallas-centric community would think playing next to Luka and KP is perfect for any player.  However, if I am his agent, my main job is to get the most I can get now and set him up for the next contract.  I'd much rather place him where he would be first or second fiddle rather than third.  That way he's got a much better shot at a five year 7-9 max money deal the next time.

A great example of this is Christian Wood.  We sent Detroit more than enough salary to match Wood and pretty clearly they preferred Wright over Ariza.  The rest of the deal with Houston wasn't hard to replicate.  My takeaway isn't that the MBT failed.  My takeaway is Wood saw a bigger role (and greater future riches) in Houston.  Crowder said the same thing about Phoenix.