2021-2022 ROSTER TALK: [ARCHIVED]

[Chicagojk]

It looks like our young guys (minus Green) plus Maxi, Willie and Jalen are in Dallas working out.  Good to see.

https://www.instagram.com/p/CRpwe19j7Th/

Also, I noticed Thad Young was in Dallas working out with the trainer Willie and Tyrell has been working out.  I wonder if he stopped by Mavs facilities.  Or maybe he just lives in the area.  

https://www.instagram.com/p/CRkPKB8F8iT/

[cow]

Jalen looks like he's 107 years old...lol

[DanSchwartzgan]

 

Also, I noticed Thad Young was in Dallas working out with the trainer Willie and Tyrell has been working out.  I wonder if he stopped by Mavs facilities.  Or maybe he just lives in the area.  

https://www.instagram.com/p/CRkPKB8F8iT/

He lives in the area.

[Kammrath]

It looks like our young guys (minus Green) plus Maxi, Willie and Jalen are in Dallas working out.  Good to see.

With Nico and Kidd watching on....evaluating the talent I assume.

[ClutchDirk]

Jalen looks like he's 107 years old...lol

https://media.giphy.com/media/LbhqriDhU2fMk/giphy.gif

[VintagePejav2]

It looks like our young guys (minus Green) plus Maxi, Willie and Jalen are in Dallas working out.  Good to see.

https://www.instagram.com/p/CRpwe19j7Th/

Also, I noticed Thad Young was in Dallas working out with the trainer Willie and Tyrell has been working out.  I wonder if he stopped by Mavs facilities.  Or maybe he just lives in the area.  

https://www.instagram.com/p/CRkPKB8F8iT/

So where’s Kristaps? Still hugging that exercise ball?

[sterlingmallory]

So where’s Kristaps? Still hugging that exercise ball?

Still in Latvia I assume

[vfromlmf]

The Athletic published a good article yesterday describing the downside of Luka's quick ascendance. He was simply too good, too fast, so Dallas never had the opportunity to build around him with high draft picks. Trading their picks for a guy like KP was really the best move available to them.

I'd argue the Mavs have another problem -- Luka's age. Teams that win in the playoffs are generally full of seasoned vets. Thirty-something guys who know how to play. But Luka is only 22 and his generation of top players are still locked into their teams on rookie deals. Guys like DeRozan, Conley, Lowry, Green are much more likely to want to play on a veteran-led team like the Lakers.

This brings me to Collins, Robinson, Ball, Graham and Holmes: younger guys who may not be ready to win at the highest level but will make this team better and also fit Luka's timeline.

I have a hard time believing ATL will let Collins walk after their run to ECF. Cuban broke up the Mavs Championship team but that was driven by concerns about an aging roster and a desire to land a bigger fish. Collins in young and fits perfectly with Young. My money has ATL dealing Gallinari and signing Collins to a near max deal. (Gallinari to Dallas?)

I like Holmes but only if the Mavs go in an entirely different direction and trade KP. I don't see it happening. KP is your unicorn center.

Robinson is interesting as an uber-efficient floor spacer but doesn't solve the Mavs secondary creator problem.

There's a lot to like about Ball but is he just the next Delon Wright, JRich? He's a better shooter than those two but he has concerning flaws in the half court. Does he want to play in Chicago?

That leaves Devonte Graham, a guy the Mavs' are known to like who just turned 26. He's an analytics darling and certainly a starter in this league -- but he's blocked behind a future star and another starting caliber guard on big money. Graham is efficient, can shoot the 3, can play on or off ball, can create for himself or others and he plays defense. He gives the Mavs another look with some speed and quickness at guard.

If I'm Dallas my first call is obviously to Kawahi ... but when he says no my next call is to Devonte Graham.

[omahen]

The Athletic published a good article yesterday describing the downside of Luka's quick ascendance. He was simply too good, too fast

I read the piece. I don't agree Luka was too good too fast. Mavs had 2019 offseason and max cap space to either add top talent (or any talent at all) or sell it for picks. They did neither. If they didn't screw up that one, they would be legit contenders in this season or would have some assets to improve now. I don't hold the other mistakes after 2019 against them, some times things just don't work out as you think (JRich, Reddick,...).

---

If I'm Dallas my first call is obviously to Kawahi ... but when he says no my next call is to Devonte Graham.

Graham is a good option, if we can get another solid piece with remaining salary. He would replace THJ shooting and leave roughly half of our 34 mil cap space (assuming JRich is gone in one way or another) to improve the big wing hole we have.

[vfromlmf]

He would replace THJ shooting and leave roughly half of our 34 mil cap space

You might have to overpay & give Graham starter money for the Hornets to let him go. They're in good financial position to match but I doubt they go $20 million for a backup guard. At that point maybe you explore sign and trade options to replace Graham in their rotation and maintain Mavs' salary flexibility. They also need a center. JRich+WCS ? That would allow you to offer Graham around $19 million in year one of a 3 year deal

[ItsGoTime]

This brings me to Collins, Robinson, Ball, Graham and Holmes: younger guys who may not be ready to win at the highest level but will make this team better and also fit Luka's timeline.

Would be kinda cool if Mavs were able to pull off the young super team and get 4 of those 5 guys (Collins and Holmes the must haves). That means most of the current team is gone KP included. We’d want vets filling in the bench roles. 

Trading KP for Collins (3 team trade) is probably the start to it, but with him being the lynchpin of this kind of thing happening. Graham, Holmes, Robinson and Ball sound like $16-22M players. I wonder if we can get a player Atl would want out of a KP deal if they would agree to letting Collins go for $25M?

A starting lineup of: Ball/Graham/Luka/Collins/Holmes looks really good on paper to me!

[Branduil]

I don't think there's any point in having both Ball and Graham, they're both too similar with overlapping strengths and weaknesses. Graham would be the cheaper and easier get I think.

[Branduil]

The Athletic published a good article yesterday describing the downside of Luka's quick ascendance. He was simply too good, too fast, so Dallas never had the opportunity to build around him with high draft picks. Trading their picks for a guy like KP was really the best move available to them.

Honestly this is still a poor excuse even if true considering some of the players who were available in free agency the past few years. We could have gotten Brogdon 2 years ago. A number of quality forwards have been available. The F.O. just utterly botched the last 2 years, and their only good signing they traded away for trash the next year.

[Mavs2021]

The Athletic published a good article yesterday describing the downside of Luka's quick ascendance. He was simply too good, too fast, so Dallas never had the opportunity to build around him with high draft picks. Trading their picks for a guy like KP was really the best move available to them.

No they simply screwed up the year before. If they had drafted Tatum, Ball, Markkanen, Isaac or Fox everything would be fine, but they had to get cute, rise from the top odds in January to 8th and screw up the pick, too.

[ItsGoTime]

I don't think there's any point in having both Ball and Graham, they're both too similar with overlapping strengths and weaknesses. Graham would be the cheaper and easier get I think.

Was going to edit in a second “or” starting lineup of Luka/Graham/Robinson/Collins/Holmes as another option. However, I don’t think overlap is all that bad with the skillset those guys possess. I don’t think LaC has a problem with the overlap of skillset with many of their players.

[Branduil]

Was going to edit in a second “or” starting lineup of Luka/Graham/Robinson/Collins/Holmes as another option. However, I don’t think overlap is all that bad with the skillset those guys possess. I don’t think LaC has a problem with the overlap of skillset with many of their players.

The problem is not what they're good at, it's what they're bad at... both Graham and Ball are horrible inside the arc, they're not a threat to score inside at all.

[Scott41theMavs]

6 days until the draft; 10 until free agency.

[ItsGoTime]

The problem is not what they're good at, it's what they're bad at... both Graham and Ball are horrible inside the arc, they're not a threat to score inside at all.

Great! Holmes, Luka and Collins are! Those guys would need help with spacing. What they are both good at is defense, and most importantly on-ball defense for the point of attack. That allows them to switch lots and stay highly active throughout the game. They can work on their inside game while being effective with what they do well.

[mvossman]

This brings me to Collins, Robinson, Ball, Graham and Holmes: younger guys who may not be ready to win at the highest level but will make this team better and also fit Luka's timeline.

I have a hard time believing ATL will let Collins walk after their run to ECF. Cuban broke up the Mavs Championship team but that was driven by concerns about an aging roster and a desire to land a bigger fish. Collins in young and fits perfectly with Young. My money has ATL dealing Gallinari and signing Collins to a near max deal. (Gallinari to Dallas?)

I like Holmes but only if the Mavs go in an entirely different direction and trade KP. I don't see it happening. KP is your unicorn center.

Robinson is interesting as an uber-efficient floor spacer but doesn't solve the Mavs secondary creator problem.

There's a lot to like about Ball but is he just the next Delon Wright, JRich? He's a better shooter than those two but he has concerning flaws in the half court. Does he want to play in Chicago?

That leaves Devonte Graham, a guy the Mavs' are known to like who just turned 26. He's an analytics darling and certainly a starter in this league -- but he's blocked behind a future star and another starting caliber guard on big money. Graham is efficient, can shoot the 3, can play on or off ball, can create for himself or others and he plays defense. He gives the Mavs another look with some speed and quickness at guard.

If I'm Dallas my first call is obviously to Kawahi ... but when he says no my next call is to Devonte Graham.

I'm not sure the Hawks are willing to pay Collins the max.  The fit is not perfect.  Collins and Capella like to operate in the same space.  There is a reason Collins numbers were down significantly from previous season.  I think he is best paired with a stretch 5.  There are not a lot of those, but we have 2.  I can see the theoretical fit on this team, just struggling with having 80 mil tied up cap to the front court when most of it should be spend on backcourt. 

Another guy you should have in the young guys list is Normal Powell.  It will be difficult to pry him away from Portland unless they blow it up, but I would have him on the list ahead of Holmes or Graham.

Graham is interesting.  He is so similar to Ball at a lot cheaper price, but I worry about his size and getting hunted in the playoffs.  Also, if we get a true secondary play maker, I'm probably going to want to stagger that guy with Luka to lead the second unit.  Not sure I want two undersized guards in the second unit.  That is something I do not have to worry about with Ball.  Honestly Ball is my first target due to talent, age and fit.  But if we can't get him or any of the other big gets, I would definitely look Graham up.  If we go that route, I would want to see if I can trade Brunson for a two way big wing into cap space.

[michaeltex]

Not to highlight my ignorance here, but why is THJ's caphold so high ($28MM+) when he was just making $18MM+ this year? I went to CBAFAQ.com and my eyes glazed over after about 30 seconds.

Luka's goes from ~$10MM to ~$25MM after next year, but that's a supermax contract. THJ ain't Luka.

I'd like to think that Holmes and Collins would be great adds for next season, but there still needs to be spacers available and I don't know if any of the rookies are up to it.