(07-26-2022, 01:48 PM)cow Wrote: Are you saying Luka is our 3rd best player?  God King is better than Wood.

(07-26-2022, 02:32 PM)IamDougieFresh Wrote: Luka - Immortal God Emperor
Wood - God Queen of Offense
DFS - God King of Defense
McGee - McShaqtin
Dwight - Interdimensional Goofus of Galactic Community Service

(07-26-2022, 06:22 PM)IamDougieFresh Wrote: It doesn’t matter how good Wood is tbh. We won’t be able to re-sign him anyways.

(07-25-2022, 08:05 PM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: It is interesting the way we’ve churned through players kind of in the 4/5 tiers.  Seth Curry made the list after his final year here.  He was traded for Josh Richardson who made the list prior to being a Mav, but not since.  Brunson made the list for the first time in his final year here and KP made the list both as a Mav and since leaving.  He’s the only Mav who was as high as a 3 his first year back from injury (but a 4 since).  We’ve been told in various ways that all had some kind of fit issue with Luka.

The list is pretty fluid.  Once you get to a certain point, a players rank isn’t self determined, but largely tied to team success.  The 20 rankings had three Mav’s besides Luka (KP, THJ and Maxi).  The 21 rankings had (KP, and THJ (barely) but Maxi dropped off.  This year has THJ, SD, DFS and Maxi, but also Wood and Bertans have been ranked on past lists (Bertans surprisingly has made the list twice).  So, without injuries and with some team success, we may get what you are seeking.  Luka and as many as six guys in the 4/5 range.  McGee and Bullock probably don’t get there.  It is also unlikely Bertans is a top 125 guy again, but I think there is a really good chance Wood, SD, DFS, THJ and Maxi get there.

My question about “THE” trade was really about what level player would we give up multiple future firsts for.  By now, we should be getting some feel for what Luka needs next to him.  I’m fine if we can give up expiring contracts and end of bench guys and land another 4/5 type.  But, I think the Mav’s have grander plans.

(07-26-2022, 08:04 AM)Kammrath Wrote: I thought about him, but didn't add him because I am concerned about his effectiveness being determined solely by being on-ball.

(07-29-2022, 12:50 PM)Chicagojk Wrote: Is Lonzo Ball not on that list?   I am going to be watching the Bulls closely this year.  I really enjoyed that team before they got hurt.   I could see them as a 4th seed next year.  Although, I can also see them as a 10th seed missing their first round pick.   

Ball is not cleared to play with a knee injury.  So in a perfect world he could be a similar buy low Dinwiddie caliber player if the Bulls struggle this year.   The may be moot if either Ball is damaged good or the Bulls regain some steam this year.  Regardless, I could see a fit for a non dominant bigger guard playing with Luka and Dinwiddie.

(07-29-2022, 01:52 PM)mvossman Wrote: Ball was my top reasonable pick in the offseason.  I think he would be a great fit with Luka.  But he is a 4.  Not somebody you make the big trade for, but I would be very interested if we could get him on the cheap.

As I look back on that offseason, there was a 3 out there that we probably had a shot at getting.  I was not a huge fan of the DeRozan fit with Luka, but I felt the same way about Din and that has worked out well.  A Luka/DeRozan pairing surrounded by 3&D guys would have been interesting.  Kind of crazy that Chicago got both guys.

(07-29-2022, 01:52 PM)mvossman Wrote: Ball was my top reasonable pick in the offseason.  I think he would be a great fit with Luka.  But he is a 4.  Not somebody you make the big trade for, but I would be very interested if we could get him on the cheap.

As I look back on that offseason, there was a 3 out there that we probably had a shot at getting.  I was not a huge fan of the DeRozan fit with Luka, but I felt the same way about Din and that has worked out well.  A Luka/DeRozan pairing surrounded by 3&D guys would have been interesting.  Kind of crazy that Chicago got both guys.

(08-01-2022, 07:48 PM)Scott41theMavs Wrote: I have to say that the past month might be my most depressing time as a Mavs fan, and I've been on board since the summer of '95. Just seeing the abject fail in losing Brunson for nothing, with no proximate pathways of improvement, the front office failing to achieve their own goal of a defensive wing, let alone the tremendous necessity of replacing Brunson's playmaking, throw in our poor prospects given recent history of keeping (or making good use in trade of) Wood, and Luka's increasingly probable eventual departure, I'm just not seeing much reason to hope. Up until now, there's always been hope of some kind. In the bleak post-2011 years, there was always Dirk. We may very well not always have Luka. What's most discouraging is the evident lack of urgency by the front office, when significant moves should have been made at least two weeks ago. It can't all be about the supposed KD and DM waits. That tells me 1) our trade "assets" have even less value league wide than we think they do here, and 2) we're probably going into to the season with this roster, which is deeply discouraging to me after last year's progress.

Hard to believe it's come to this point just a couple of months after the high of making the WCFs. 

Of course, the probable second-most depressing and bleak-seeming time was probably the few days between Nellie Sr. nuking what was left of the three J's and his miraculously convincing Finley to extend rather than walking. Unfortunately, Nellie is on a beach in Maui and not here.

(08-02-2022, 07:57 AM)Chicagojk Wrote: It really bothered me we lost JB.  Not so much paying him close to 30 million but how we made a mistake on our internal evaluation.   I believe it is a misconception here that JB made a huge jump this past year.   I think that is untrue and unfair.   He had a bad Clippers series.  It happens.  The coach drastically cut his minutes where he couldn't play through his mistakes.   If we play the Clippers in a series again, there will probably make life tough for a few of our players still.  It was a bad matchup for JB.   But he was good that year and he well deserved the contract he should have been offered.   I know things are not always black or white with moves, so I try to see both sides.  But the offer should have been made to JB last offseason.

I keep saying for the past 2-3 years that yes Dallas missed an opportunity, but there is still time.   I still believe this.  Whether it was passing on Maxey in the draft, striking out in FA, etc.   The issue is, the Mavs really can't afford to make many more mistakes moving forward.

I think the Mavs will take a step back this year.   I thought this even if they signed Brunson.   But if we think positive and use a lot of if and buts, there is some hope for this upcoming season and moving forward with added flexibility.   Dinwiddie is bigger than Jalen and given the added role he may be able to make a jump in production.  I am still worried about health long term with him.    Can McGee be better than Powell?   Maybe as good as a role man but a better rebounder and rim protector?   The big question is can Dallas find a guy who can do 70% of the protection as Jalen as your third creator?   Maybe it is someone between Jalen and Trey Burke production.  If they can, then you have added a better starting center, a bigger backcourt mate in Dinwiddie, and also adding Wood and getting Hardaway back.  I need to see Wood play in a winning environment.  There have been times where i thought he was exactly what we needed.  Other times, I thought he was going through the motions.  If he is that guy, he sort of does the things we expected KP to do on offense.   

Is this the team that will win a championship?  I severely doubt it.  For me it is closer to a play in team than contender in the deep west.  But no one wants to play Luka plus shooters in a playoff series.   I could see them back to the same spot next playoffs in the conference finals.  I wouldn't be on it, but I think it is possible.

(08-02-2022, 07:57 AM)Chicagojk Wrote: It really bothered me we lost JB.  Not so much paying him close to 30 million but how we made a mistake on our internal evaluation.   I believe it is a misconception here that JB made a huge jump this past year.   I think that is untrue and unfair.   He had a bad Clippers series.  It happens.  The coach drastically cut his minutes where he couldn't play through his mistakes.   If we play the Clippers in a series again, there will probably make life tough for a few of our players still.  It was a bad matchup for JB.   But he was good that year and he well deserved the contract he should have been offered.   I know things are not always black or white with moves, so I try to see both sides.  But the offer should have been made to JB last offseason.

I keep saying for the past 2-3 years that yes Dallas missed an opportunity, but there is still time.   I still believe this.  Whether it was passing on Maxey in the draft, striking out in FA, etc.   The issue is, the Mavs really can't afford to make many more mistakes moving forward.

I think the Mavs will take a step back this year.   I thought this even if they signed Brunson.   But if we think positive and use a lot of if and buts, there is some hope for this upcoming season and moving forward with added flexibility.   Dinwiddie is bigger than Jalen and given the added role he may be able to make a jump in production.  I am still worried about health long term with him.    Can McGee be better than Powell?   Maybe as good as a role man but a better rebounder and rim protector?   The big question is can Dallas find a guy who can do 70% of the protection as Jalen as your third creator?   Maybe it is someone between Jalen and Trey Burke production.  If they can, then you have added a better starting center, a bigger backcourt mate in Dinwiddie, and also adding Wood and getting Hardaway back.  I need to see Wood play in a winning environment.  There have been times where i thought he was exactly what we needed.  Other times, I thought he was going through the motions.  If he is that guy, he sort of does the things we expected KP to do on offense.   

Is this the team that will win a championship?  I severely doubt it.  For me it is closer to a play in team than contender in the deep west.  But no one wants to play Luka plus shooters in a playoff series.   I could see them back to the same spot next playoffs in the conference finals.  I wouldn't be on it, but I think it is possible.

(08-02-2022, 07:57 AM)Chicagojk Wrote: It really bothered me we lost JB.  Not so much paying him close to 30 million but how we made a mistake on our internal evaluation.   I believe it is a misconception here that JB made a huge jump this past year.   I think that is untrue and unfair.   He had a bad Clippers series.  It happens.  The coach drastically cut his minutes where he couldn't play through his mistakes.   If we play the Clippers in a series again, there will probably make life tough for a few of our players still.  It was a bad matchup for JB.   But he was good that year and he well deserved the contract he should have been offered.   I know things are not always black or white with moves, so I try to see both sides.  But the offer should have been made to JB last offseason.

I keep saying for the past 2-3 years that yes Dallas missed an opportunity, but there is still time.   I still believe this.  Whether it was passing on Maxey in the draft, striking out in FA, etc.   The issue is, the Mavs really can't afford to make many more mistakes moving forward.

I think the Mavs will take a step back this year.   I thought this even if they signed Brunson.   But if we think positive and use a lot of if and buts, there is some hope for this upcoming season and moving forward with added flexibility.   Dinwiddie is bigger than Jalen and given the added role he may be able to make a jump in production.  I am still worried about health long term with him.    Can McGee be better than Powell?   Maybe as good as a role man but a better rebounder and rim protector?   The big question is can Dallas find a guy who can do 70% of the protection as Jalen as your third creator?   Maybe it is someone between Jalen and Trey Burke production.  If they can, then you have added a better starting center, a bigger backcourt mate in Dinwiddie, and also adding Wood and getting Hardaway back.  I need to see Wood play in a winning environment.  There have been times where i thought he was exactly what we needed.  Other times, I thought he was going through the motions.  If he is that guy, he sort of does the things we expected KP to do on offense.   

Is this the team that will win a championship?  I severely doubt it.  For me it is closer to a play in team than contender in the deep west.  But no one wants to play Luka plus shooters in a playoff series.   I could see them back to the same spot next playoffs in the conference finals.  I wouldn't be on it, but I think it is possible.

(08-02-2022, 01:36 PM)F Gump Wrote: One note about the Mavs' future --

Many in this forum are assuming that Wood will be great. Some even pronounce doom-and-gloom down the road over how the Mavs are supposedly holding him back from being an All-Star, by using him off the bench. LOL

If you get tired of such extreme assertions, and want something more objective, get feedback from Houston. Many there find it laughable to hear him being mentioned as a future All-Star, and think the Rox fleeced Dallas in the trade by merely getting a FRP. If you ask them, the assumption that he's going to be great is laughable, and is based on nothing except him now having a different uniform.

I am reminded of how Jerry West has long preached that the biggest mistakes in player evaluation are those that see big stats by a player on an awful team, and thinking that such a player would be even better on your team. Someone on that bad team WILL get points and rebounds, but in a team-oriented sharing concept where others are there that can do things too, the whole dynamic changes.

The point being, the Mavs caution and their approaches with Wood emphasizing a need to play defense first, and their "earn it" approach, is shocking to fans who just assume this guy will be stellar, but is way more merited than we think. Just because he was the Mavs' splashiest add doesn't mean he will be All That. The jury is still out.