(06-22-2024, 03:30 PM)mvossman Wrote: In regards to Thybulle, I also pointed out that he takes more attempts than DJJ (even after DJJ raised his attempts by 50% here).  Thybulle actually shoots more often than all of DJJ, Green and Exum, and I would expect that to increase if he were playing with Luka (although I do realize that part of that is because he doesn't do much else offensively).

(06-22-2024, 01:19 PM)F Gump Wrote: The idea of using Green to clear space OR to be a trade chip has been well discussed here, and probably will continue to be. But we have to factor in that THJ is gone for sure, so if Green is outgoing, then it's both THJ and Green outgoing, and in the big scheme of things, it doesn't matter which you do 1st (THJ or Green) or which one yields a player and which one yields room -- either way you end up with the ability to sign DJJ and add another player with a salary total between the 2 of about 28.6M.

(06-22-2024, 03:32 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: Well now, THAT is information I hadn't caught up with yet. Thanks! 

That does move the needle some, actually.

(06-22-2024, 02:18 PM)F Gump Wrote: No they can't make the trade now, with a delayed execution date. They can agree in principle, but no one can commit to a deal until it's legal. And it has to be submitted to NBA and be approved, CBA-legal at the point it's submitted.

"Announcing" a trade is weird. It can (and often does) get leaked, rather than anything being said by the team to the public. And in the older days, announcing something before it was legal was strictly forbidden, with penalties. I think they've relaxed those rules to some degree, although I really don't have a good feel anymore on what can or can't be done.

(06-22-2024, 03:32 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: Well now, THAT is information I hadn't caught up with yet. Thanks! 

That does move the needle some, actually.

(06-22-2024, 04:06 PM)Mavs2021 Wrote: Anyone ever heard that one before from reddit via realgm: Cuban lost basketball control when he signed Curry with out telling anyone. That forced the front office to change Jones Jr’s deal from 3 to 1 year.

(06-22-2024, 03:27 PM)F Gump Wrote: Here's a tweak to some of the ideas above that might solve ALL the needs (if you can figure out who goes in the empty slot). The specific moves don't have to be these exact ones - they can be done in any number of ways. Using the ideas above:

1 Swap Green for pick 26 (WAS) which you plan to use. (You may or may not piggy-back another player on this to come to DAL.)
2 Trade THJ-Lawson for Thybulle. (You may or may not piggy-back another player on this to come to DAL.)
3 Don't resign Morris.

Now you have 12 players with 2 open roster slots, and about 19.5M for DJJ and 1 more player salary (via trade, or BAE). SIDE NOTE: I think DJJ would be overpaid at 12.9M MLE, and would hope to see him signed more in the 10.5-11M range. But that's just details.

Can you find an offensive player that works in that scenario?

(06-22-2024, 04:12 PM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: This is why I raised the idea of Green to the TPE in Washington.  His salary in June fits, but it doesn’t in July.  So, this has to be done in two parts since THybulle can’t be traded here in June.

Portland has four picks in this draft and none in 2025.  Maybe it is THJ/protected 2025 for Thybulle/#34 (executed in July like we did a year ago) and you fill an open slot with the salary of that second rounder from Portland.

(06-22-2024, 04:16 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: Like the way you're thinking, but don't like including 2025 in that deal. If they're interested in Hardaway at all, getting off of the Thybulle contract (for which they have Dallas to blame) has got to be at least part of the motivation, so I'm hopeful they can find a way to do the deal at a lower cost.

(06-22-2024, 04:16 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: Like the way you're thinking, but don't like including 2025 in that deal. If they're interested in Hardaway at all, getting off of the Thybulle contract (for which they have Dallas to blame) has got to be at least part of the motivation, so I'm hopeful they can find a way to do the deal at a lower cost.

(06-22-2024, 04:27 PM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: Getting off the Thybulle contract?  If his O has improved as much as some here are saying, I think he will certainly cost something.

In fact, if he shoots better than DJJ and defends as good as DJJ, why are we trading Josh to create room for DJJ?  Just deal THJ/pick for Thybulle/pick and call it a day.  PJ/Maxi/OMax are your bigger wing defenders and Thybulle/Green/Exum are your smaller wing defenders.  It puts some pressure on Hardy, but it is time for him to sh$t or get off the pot anyway.

(06-22-2024, 04:28 PM)mvossman Wrote: Yeah, we would be doing each other a favor.  I would be fine with sending a second or two, but not the first.

(06-22-2024, 04:36 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: Idk, man. Not sure I see it that way. 

If they matched the Dallas offer only to entertain trading him the next year. 

I can get behind the idea of adding a sweetener, but I'd probably include a 2nd and not ask for a pick back) is much more in line with reality. I am out if the cost is a 2025 first, even if you're right.

(06-22-2024, 04:49 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: Here's a question maybe one of you Thybulle truthers can help me with, and I'm hoping to hear from someone who watches and appreciates him as a player, not just some type of stats-based argument:

Setting aside the obvious elephant in the room (his offense), if Thybulle is SO impactful as a defender, why doesn't anyone ever talk about him? I mean, think about all the talk there is from analysts, everyone from the idiot-Steven A level all the way to guys like Redick, about guys like Dillon Brooks, Lu Dort, Marcus Smart, Jrue Holiday, etc...why does Thybulle NEVER seem to get brought up in those conversations? He's not overly young or unknown. Hell, he doesn't even get mentioned as much as Ntilikina used to be.

I mean that question genuinely, not in some sarcastic, leading way. I'm really interested in hearing from an actual fan of him as a player, not someone who's just a fan of him through advanced stats. Sometimes, there are people in both of those camps, so I don't mean to imply anything uncool, just to clarify the type of analysis I'm interested in learning on this topic. I mean, even his own national team made him play behind Josh Green last summer. I get that the rules make international play even MORE offensive leaning than the NBA, but, still. I wonder if this isn't a case of "greener grass over there" when it comes to Thybulle's defense. I buy that he's a good defender, just not sure I can get to where some people's opinions of his D seem to live.

(06-22-2024, 04:49 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: Here's a question maybe one of you Thybulle truthers can help me with, and I'm hoping to hear from someone who watches and appreciates him as a player, not just some type of stats-based argument:

Setting aside the obvious elephant in the room (his offense), if Thybulle is SO impactful as a defender, why doesn't anyone ever talk about him? I mean, think about all the talk there is from analysts, everyone from the idiot-Steven A level all the way to guys like Redick, about guys like Dillon Brooks, Lu Dort, Marcus Smart, Jrue Holiday, etc...why does Thybulle NEVER seem to get brought up in those conversations? He's not overly young or unknown. Hell, he doesn't even get mentioned as much as Ntilikina used to be.

I mean that question genuinely, not in some sarcastic, leading way. I'm really interested in hearing from an actual fan of him as a player, not someone who's just a fan of him through advanced stats. Sometimes, there are people in both of those camps, so I don't mean to imply anything uncool, just to clarify the type of analysis I'm interested in learning on this topic. I mean, even his own national team made him play behind Josh Green last summer. I get that the rules make international play even MORE offensive leaning than the NBA, but, still. I wonder if this isn't a case of "greener grass over there" when it comes to Thybulle's defense. I buy that he's a good defender, just not sure I can get to where some people's opinions of his D seem to live.

(06-22-2024, 05:01 PM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: So, teams shut down their bad players to tank?  Then why are we talking about him if a team like Portland wants to get off of him.  What am I missing here?