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RE: Trade & FA 2024-25: Siakam to Sign 4yr/189mil deal July 1st w/Pacers - Mavs2021 - 06-20-2024
(06-20-2024, 10:09 AM)mvossman Wrote: I think you are underestimating how bad Thybulle is on offense. He is roughly the same animal as DJJ from 3, but he literally does nothing else. The goal is to improve the offense without taking a significant hit defensively. Thybulle would be going the wrong way.
I also think you are overestimating Maxi market value. He is very likely a negative asset due to his age, health concerns and contract. Why wouldn't Indy just keep Jalen, who is 23 and just had his best year?
Carlisle knows and values Kleber. He´s a good back-up for Siakam/Turner, while also opening minutes for Jarace Wallace. Of course if Smith opts out to sign a better deal in Indiana, then the trade is not happening.
But I´m fairly certain that Smith and Indiana are very open to other options, given that he played a total of 32 minutes over seven games in the play-offs, and mostly garbage time minutes at that. That´s the same amount as AJ Lawson. Carlisle clearly did not fancy him. He was virtually a DNP-coach´s decision in the play-offs.
Are we worse offensively with these trades? Very rudimentary, but Kleber/THJ combined for 18.8 PPG in 47 minutes during the regular season vs. 15.4 PPG for Thybulle/Smith in 40 minutes. Smith was clearly the best shooter amongst the four players. There is certainly more upside in the Thybulle/Smith pairing.
And of course I´m aware how bad Thybulle is offensively, but that´s the reason he is one of the few THJ trades that make sense financial sense and would not cost us significant assets.
RE: Trade & FA 2024-25: ORL Favorites to Sign Klay | Mitchell May Not Sign Extension - Ghost of Podkolzin - 06-20-2024
Core:
PG - Luka
SG - Kyrie
SF -
PF - PJ
C - Gafford, Lively
Absolute Needs:
A. Starting SF/PF (defensive stud, good rebounder, at least 37%3pt and can get you ~18pts/game)
B. 6th Man (great shooter, facilitator, team defender, can get you ~15pts/game)
Targets for A (Starting SF/PF):
High $ - PG13, Wiggins, Kuzma, J.Grant
Reasonable $ - Deni, H.Jones
Low $, Huge Value - T.Eason, GG.Jackson, Kuminga, T.MurphyIII
Good Value: DFS, N.Marshall
Targets for B (6th Man):
On the roster (if not used in trade): J.Green, Hardy
Vet Value: Westbrook
RE: Trade & FA 2024-25: ORL Favorites to Sign Klay | Mitchell May Not Sign Extension - KillerLeft - 06-20-2024
It's tough to pinpoint Kleber's value for a variety of reasons, but count me in the group who thinks he has become underrated around here this year.
Yes, availability is the primary ability. That's a universal, timeless truth that's becoming even more relevant in this age of more dense scheduling, when the league is employing measures intended to discourage load management. And yes, Kleber's injury history and general lack of availability is getting more and more frustrating. I won't argue with any of that. Based on THAT, you could argue his contract is too large, sure.
However, people are starting to act as though his PLAY has slipped, and I don't see it that way, personally. I mean, maybe a little, but mostly, when he's going badly, my take is that it's directly correlated to some injury he's trying to recover from. Like, that thing with his toe was crazy this year! If I remember correctly, he's now having to wear some crude device in his shoe to prevent certain types of slippage. A good solution, but it sounds like something a guy who runs, jumps and changes directions for a living might take a little while to get used to, right? Also, for those who don't realize this, a big part of shooting seems to be about foot-work and balance. It also seems crazy to kill him for shooting when he's playing with an injury TO HIS SHOOTING SHOULDER.
I get the "well he's ALWAYS hurt" argument. Really, I do. But right now, it doesn't seem like anyone is giving him credit for fighting through injuries to be on the floor during the last two rounds of the playoffs (according to some of the estimates I saw when he fell and sustained the injury, I'd guess he pushed the timeline of recovery pretty hard), and instead we're all just focused on the shots he didn't consider/attempt/make. Those things are all worth talking about, don't get me wrong, but it's not like he just forgot how to shoot. He was working through things he couldn't overcome on the timeline the team needed. Frustrating, I know, but HE WAS ON THE FLOOR BECAUSE THEY NEEDED HIM, not to do him any favors.
He was one of the best defenders on the team in the Finals. Much better than Lively or Gafford in the ways that mattered in that matchup, and he did so playing mostly 4, which I believe is out of position for him. Even if you disagree, it's pretty undeniable that he has played more 5 here during his Mavs career than 4, so I hope we can all at least acknowledge that it's another on the list of things that are out of his comfort zone.
Will he ever be healthy again, and if so, will that get him back to his "leading up to 2022" form? I have no earthly idea, but I'm not ready to loudly proclaim it's not possible. And, if he can get back to that, the contract won't be a problem at all. Quite the bargain, actually. I think what people are losing sight of is that what he brings to the table is so rare and so coveted that you almost MUST hope he regains that form because that's a more plausible hope than the hope that you can replace him. I mean, Al Horford has a similar skillset (hasn't been as versatile of a defender as Kleber for years, but similar) and he's going to have a job in the league literally as long as he can muster up the life force to accept it.
My point is this: while the injuries/availability part probably affects Kleber's trade value quite a bit, none of us know to what extent, and I'm pretty confident that some team out there would be open to taking a chance on him. There just aren't many guys who can do what he can do. Ten years from now there will be dozens of them, but right now he's still a pretty unique player. The true question, to my way of thinking, is can the Mavs afford to trade him? I am in favor of it if it's helpful, but my goodness they'd better have a plan for replacing him first.
RE: Trade & FA 2024-25: ORL Favorites to Sign Klay | Mitchell May Not Sign Extension - Chicagojk - 06-20-2024
(06-20-2024, 11:15 AM)HAguiar95 Wrote: I would love to be the team to land Mario Hezonja as a reclamation project (kinda like Exum).
Liked his stint in ORL, can defend and hit 43% from deep this last Euoleague.
The guy who leaked my attention is Jabari Parker who played in Europe last year. In the 5 minute highlights I saw he looked good. Skilled big man who can score. Defense
and health are the big concerns.
RE: Trade & FA 2024-25: ORL Favorites to Sign Klay | Mitchell May Not Sign Extension - surfpuckmd - 06-20-2024
(06-20-2024, 03:30 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: It's tough to pinpoint Kleber's value for a variety of reasons, but count me in the group who thinks he has become underrated around here this year.
...
My point is this: while the injuries/availability part probably affects Kleber's trade value quite a bit, none of us know to what extent, and I'm pretty confident that some team out there would be open to taking a chance on him. There just aren't many guys who can do what he can do. Ten years from now there will be dozens of them, but right now he's still a pretty unique player. The true question, to my way of thinking, is can the Mavs afford to trade him? I am in favor of it if it's helpful, but my goodness they'd better have a plan for replacing him first.
When he is available and hitting his 3-pointers, Maxi is a really good role player. Unfortunately, that's not very often. I don't think there would be much trade market for him around the league given his contract.
I'd much rather keep him and hope that we can get some good playoff minutes from him next season. I don't think we can depend on him for too much but he's a nice luxury to have on the bench in certain matchups. I appreciate how he quickly he came back from injury and how hard he played despite the bad shoulder.
RE: Trade & FA 2024-25: ORL Favorites to Sign Klay | Mitchell May Not Sign Extension - KillerLeft - 06-20-2024
(06-20-2024, 04:04 PM)surfpuckmd Wrote: When he is available and hitting his 3-pointers, Maxi is a really good role player. Unfortunately, that's not very often. I don't think there would be much trade market for him around the league given his contract.
I'd much rather keep him and hope that we can get some good playoff minutes from him next season.
While I'm not sure I agree with your first statement (and honestly, my main thought is that we just don't know what his market would be), I DEFINITElY agree with your second point. Unless his trade value is VERY GOOD, I think the best option is to hope he gets himself right for next season. Truly.
Having said that, he is technically expendable from a binary, black-and-white POV, so if his salary is a necessary component in hypothetical pursuit of someone expensive and truly impactful, like Jerami Grant, for example, I'd be open to it.
RE: Trade & FA 2024-25: ORL Favorites to Sign Klay | Mitchell May Not Sign Extension - Mavs2021 - 06-20-2024
Making the NBA finals is worth it for the shortened time between the last game, the draft and free agency alone.
Page 13. I take a wild guess and say we easily hit 113 pages last year.
RE: Trade & FA 2024-25: ORL Favorites to Sign Klay | Mitchell May Not Sign Extension - michaeltex - 06-20-2024
Question for the brilliant minds here...
We have been talking a lot about making whatever moves are necessary to re-sign DJJ, moving THJ, maybe moving Green, etc.
My question is whether there is a clock ticking on this. Does something need to happen before July 1st? Does it need to happen before the draft? Does it need to happen before FA signing starts?
Just looking for the urgency associated with these decisions.
Thanks.
RE: Trade & FA 2024-25: CHI Not Done Trading - SleepingHero - 06-20-2024
Joe Cowley (@JCowleyHoops)
According to a source, Bulls also feel there is a growing trade market for Zach LaVine with a handful of teams feeling like they have no shot at the several coveted free agents that will be out there. Let the game of chicken begin ...
RE: Trade & FA 2024-25: CHI Not Done Trading - SleepingHero - 06-20-2024
NBACentral (@TheDunkCentral)
There is a ‘growing’ trade market for Zach LaVine, per @JCowleyHoops
LaVine could be the next Bull traded
RE: Trade & FA 2024-25: CHI Not Done Trading - SleepingHero - 06-20-2024
Evan Sidery (@esidery)
The Bulls are nowhere close to done on the trade market.
Chicago is actively trying to move Zach LaVine, but also appear willing to part with Nikola Vucevic for the right price.
Moving Alex Caruso was the first step in long-awaited changes coming for Chicago.
Lavine+Vucevic are probably next up.
RE: Trade & FA 2024-25: CHI Not Done Trading - SleepingHero - 06-20-2024
https://twitter.com/NationMffl/status/1803890270708109392
Naji Marshall is an interesting name after seeing these stats and film.
RE: Trade & FA 2024-25: ORL Favorites to Sign Klay | Mitchell May Not Sign Extension - F Gump - 06-20-2024
(06-20-2024, 04:52 PM)michaeltex Wrote: Question for the brilliant minds here...
We have been talking a lot about making whatever moves are necessary to re-sign DJJ, moving THJ, maybe moving Green, etc.
My question is whether there is a clock ticking on this. Does something need to happen before July 1st? Does it need to happen before the draft? Does it need to happen before FA signing starts?
Just looking for the urgency associated with these decisions.
Thanks.
Moves to open up enough cap permission to re-sign DJJ (sliding the number higher from 5.2M and towards 12.9M MLE) probably aren't possible in June. No one has cap room to offer right now.
But assuming that's their goal, it seems close to certain they will work out that deal now, for July. Unfortunately for us, we are unlikely to hear about any swap set for July, until we get past June 30.
I think that would be their first domino, and none of the rest (even if several are lined up now) will be made public until the cap-clearing move is locked up and done.
RE: Trade & FA 2024-25: CHI Not Done Trading - SleepingHero - 06-20-2024
Evan Sidery (@esidery)
Due to the DeMar DeRozan sign-and-trade with the Spurs in 2021, the Bulls do not technically own their 2025 first-round pick.
Chicago’s pick is top-10 protected, so they are fully incentivized to potentially attempt to bottom out in what is regarded as an elite draft class.
RE: Trade & FA 2024-25: CHI Not Done Trading - audiosway - 06-20-2024
Another end of the bench shooter I'm very interested in is Davis Bertans. Dallas could have used the Latvian Laser in limited minutes big time during the finals to provide a spark off the bench. A guy that can just come in and hit 40+% of 3s along with having the length and fast delivery to not get blocked would have been huge for the Mavs in the Finals.
RE: Trade & FA 2024-25: CHI Not Done Trading - Jason Terry - 06-20-2024
Thank you for that Maxi manifesto Killer Left. I needed that today. Maxi’s best comp at this point is Al Horford. Here’s to keeping Maxi around for many more years
Speaking of 5’s……..
Let’s not forget about one of the biggest (top 3?) 3 pointers in Mavs NBA Finals history……..
The Lively 3 that we witnessed. That one shot should give us so much hope and confidence in the future. Smile and be happy, the state of the center position on your Dallas mavs looks amazing
RE: Trade & FA 2024-25: CHI Not Done Trading - audiosway - 06-20-2024
I put together a list of guys I would love to see replaced at the end of the bench and who I would look at as free agents in order.
Guys to move:
Powell
THJ
Morris
Brandon Williams
Priority:
Resign DJJ
FAs to look into:
DFS (Bench wing)
Dinwiddie (Ball handler/shooter with size)
Bertans (Shooter off the bench to replace THJ)
Bamba (Shot blocker to replace Powell)
Gary Payton II (Shooter/defender)
I think turning over the bottom of the bench with some of these guys that want to fill roles would be huge for Dallas. I would talk Dinwiddie into coming into the 6th man role. The would give Kyrie a bigger guard that can handle the ball and shoot to play with on the bench unit.
Bamba could fill Powell's role to provide depth when a big is injured or to provide some shot blocking if necessary.
Gary Payton II is a very solid defender and great shooter. Great team guy.
DFS is that bench 3&D wing vet to come in and spell DJJ/PJ.
Bertans would be one that you could bring into a game at any time that would provide a spark of energy and lights out deep shooting. He can come in and hit 3-4 threes really quick to get a team going or provide a long shooter for mismatches.
RE: Trade & FA 2024-25: CHI Not Done Trading - audiosway - 06-20-2024
(06-20-2024, 05:29 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: https://twitter.com/NationMffl/status/1803890270708109392
Naji Marshall is an interesting name after seeing these stats and film.
He is another guy I was looking. Depends on his price. We just need end of the bench guys and depth at this point.
RE: Trade & FA 2024-25: CHI Not Done Trading - Ghost of Podkolzin - 06-20-2024
(06-20-2024, 05:29 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: https://twitter.com/NationMffl/status/1803890270708109392
Naji Marshall is an interesting name after seeing these stats and film.
Ya, I had him in the list of possible targets...
Core:
PG - Luka
SG - Kyrie
SF -
PF - PJ
C - Gafford, Lively
Absolute Needs:
A. Starting SF/PF (defensive stud, good rebounder, at least 37%3pt and can get you ~18pts/game)
B. 6th Man (great shooter, facilitator, team defender, can get you ~15pts/game)
Targets for A (Starting SF/PF):
High $ - PG13, Wiggins, Kuzma, J.Grant
Reasonable $ - Deni, H.Jones
Low $, Huge Value - T.Eason, GG.Jackson, Kuminga, T.MurphyIII
Good Value: DFS, N.Marshall
Targets for B (6th Man):
On the roster (if not used in trade): J.Green, Hardy
Vet Value: Westbrook
RE: Trade & FA 2024-25: ORL Favorites to Sign Klay | Mitchell May Not Sign Extension - BolsDamols - 06-20-2024
(06-20-2024, 04:15 PM)Mavs2021 Wrote: Making the NBA finals is worth it for the shortened time between the last game, the draft and free agency alone.
Page 13. I take a wild guess and say we easily hit 113 pages last year.
Such a different vibe in this offseason than getting excited for FA signings like Harrison Barnes, Wesley Matthews, Chandler Parsons, Christian Wood or pipe dreams like signing Giannis, pairing Dwight Howard/CP3 with Dirk, etc. Although I see Lebron talk has started, its not coming from a place of desperation.
What a difference even a single good draft and free agency period can do for a team. I hope this offseason will be as good if not better than last.