Why is it that the Knicks can get away offering TO on the final years of contracts they give out? Fournier, Drose, Noel, and Burks all signed up for TO in the final years of their contracts. The NYK have been doling out these type of contracts for several years now and it doesn't seem to hurt them at all in FA or with players.
What are the chances THJ signed up for a TO in his final year like Fournier did?
I mean. Look at the names. Not really the top ranked free agents and it´s not like they aren´t getting a lot of guaranteed money.
(08-04-2021, 06:40 PM)dirkfansince1998 Wrote: [ -> ]I mean. Look at the names. Not really the top ranked free agents and it´s not like they aren´t getting a lot of guaranteed money.
They aren't big names. Neither are the names that the Mavs are signing either. But somehow the NYK manages to remain flexible by giving out team friendly contracts while the Mavs are required to give player friendly contracts in order to get Free Agents to sign.
Let me use the example above. Fournier and THJ are similar players (although Fournier is probably the better player). They both signed similar contracts except Fournier's contract is only guaranteed for three years while THJ is guaranteed for four.
If Fournier does not perform up to expectations the NYK can simply not renew the final year of his contract while if THJ performs similarly they are stuck for full four years. Having these type of TO in contracts also makes players more easily moveable in trades.
(08-04-2021, 07:25 PM)Playmaker Wrote: [ -> ]They aren't big names. Neither are the names that the Mavs are signing either. But somehow the NYK manages to remain flexible by giving out team friendly contracts while the Mavs are required to give player friendly contracts in order to get Free Agents to sign.
Let me use the example above. Fournier and THJ are similar players (although Fournier is probably the better player). They both signed similar contracts except Fournier's contract is only guaranteed for three years while THJ is guaranteed for four.
If Fournier does not perform up to expectations the NYK can simply not renew the final year of his contract while if THJ performs similarly they are stuck for full four years. Having these type of TO in contracts also makes players more easily moveable in trades.
THJ took a discount to stay in Dallas. According to the rumors he could have signed a 80+ million deal with the Pacers and Pistons. Taking less to stay in Dallas looks pretty team friendly to me.
(08-04-2021, 07:25 PM)Playmaker Wrote: [ -> ]They aren't big names. Neither are the names that the Mavs are signing either. But somehow the NYK manages to remain flexible by giving out team friendly contracts while the Mavs are required to give player friendly contracts in order to get Free Agents to sign.
Let me use the example above. Fournier and THJ are similar players (although Fournier is probably the better player). They both signed similar contracts except Fournier's contract is only guaranteed for three years while THJ is guaranteed for four.
If Fournier does not perform up to expectations the NYK can simply not renew the final year of his contract while if THJ performs similarly they are stuck for full four years. Having these type of TO in contracts also makes players more easily moveable in trades.
Hardaway was already agreeing to take less money to stay here.
(08-04-2021, 07:31 PM)dirkfansince1998 Wrote: [ -> ]THJ took a discount to stay in Dallas. According to the rumors he could have signed a 80+ million deal with the Pacers and Pistons. Taking less to stay in Dallas looks pretty team friendly to me.
According to who? His agent? Where is there proof that THJ ever got that offer?
(08-04-2021, 07:43 PM)Playmaker Wrote: [ -> ]According to who? His agent? Where is there proof that THJ ever got that offer?
Detroit and New Orleans offers have been reported multiple places. If you don't want to believe them that's fine, but it also means you can't believe anything else that's simply 'reported' (including the details of Fournier's contract since it can't be officially finalized and 'proven' for another couple of days).
(08-04-2021, 07:43 PM)Playmaker Wrote: [ -> ]According to who? His agent? Where is there proof that THJ ever got that offer?
We get the reports. And the sources are obviously agents, GMs or other front office guys. Are you asking for a printed version of the contract?
We already had this discussion yesterday and it did not end well. You can believe whatever you want. Buy certain stories. Dismiss others.
Back to the THJ topic. On his podcast Kevin O´Connor mentioned a 88m offer from the Pelicans.
(08-04-2021, 07:43 PM)Playmaker Wrote: [ -> ]According to who? His agent? Where is there proof that THJ ever got that offer?
Clutch and Kam and others have posted over a thousand pieces of news over the last few days. The THJ reports are there. But man, I don't want to search all those pages!
I find info released after the fact to be quite interesting. We didn't hear anything about any offers to THJ before signing his contract with the Mavs but all the sudden he turned down other offers after his signing. I don't think I buy the PR spin on THJ receiving a higher offer. I like to look at things logically.
So let's see over the last few years Bodgan, Fournier, Powell, ect all similar (probably better) players than THJ signed for around 18 mil per season. So you guys are telling me the Pistons and NO wanted to set a new market for sixth men types at 22 mil per for THJ. Call me skeptical.
(08-04-2021, 09:05 PM)Playmaker Wrote: [ -> ]I find info released after the fact to be quite interesting. We didn't hear anything about any offers to THJ before signing his contract with the Mavs but all the sudden he turned down other offers after his signing. I don't think I buy the PR spin on THJ receiving a higher offer. I like to look at things logically.
So let's see over the last few years Bodgan, Fournier, Powell, ect all similar (probably better) players than THJ signed for around 18 mil per season. So you guys are telling me the Pistons and NO wanted to set a new market for sixth men types at 22 mil per for THJ. Call me skeptical.
I don't think you understand what we're saying. There were multiple reports of offers from other teams before he signed his contract. You don't have to believe them, but it's incorrect to say non were reported.
(08-04-2021, 09:05 PM)Playmaker Wrote: [ -> ]I find info released after the fact to be quite interesting. We didn't hear anything about any offers to THJ before signing his contract with the Mavs but all the sudden he turned down other offers after his signing. I don't think I buy the PR spin on THJ receiving a higher offer. I like to look at things logically.
So let's see over the last few years Bodgan, Fournier, Powell, ect all similar (probably better) players than THJ signed for around 18 mil per season. So you guys are telling me the Pistons and NO wanted to set a new market for sixth men types at 22 mil per for THJ. Call me skeptical.
The Detroit pursuit was reported before the trade deadline; don't know about the Pelicans, he might have been a pivot once they realized they weren't getting Lowry.
As far as logic goes, if you don't believe reputable published reports, then you don't actually know what Fournier or Powell are getting, because, again, nobody's contract is signed and offical for another couple of days. That leaves you with Bogdan--who was a year ago in a different market.
And what exactly is the logic of
a) an agent publicizing that he *failed* to get his client more money? Putting the number into the media before he agreed to Dallas makes some sense as leverage against Dallas, but reporting it afterwards is just pointing out his failure to successfully leverage Dallas.
b) why would anyone report something as a fact that an aspiring reporter could just call New Orleans (or Detroit) and ask "Yes or no, did you offer THJ more than he eventually signed for?". Good way to lose your job as a journalist.
Logically speaking, you're just having a hard time admitting that you were wrong about something.
(08-04-2021, 06:32 PM)Playmaker Wrote: [ -> ]Why is it that the Knicks can get away offering TO on the final years of contracts they give out? Fournier, Drose, Noel, and Burks all signed up for TO in the final years of their contracts. The NYK have been doling out these type of contracts for several years now and it doesn't seem to hurt them at all in FA or with players.
What are the chances THJ signed up for a TO in his final year like Fournier did?
You do know Leon Rose, the guy who's running the Knicks use to be an agent right?