MavsBoard

(06-11-2021, 01:19 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: [ -> ]I agree with this, but I ALSO think there's an unpredictable human element to all of this that we just can't make sense of, no matter how hard we try. 

Maybe there's something in Richardson that just changed forever when Miami traded him. Sometimes, people just fall out of love with doing stuff they're really into and stop going so hard. Stuff like that happens around us all the time in real life. It has probably happened TO all of us, at some point.

Interesting point. Do we know anything about whether J Rich is still going hard? Serious question. I don't remember hearing anything on that, one way or the other. 

At the end of the day, all that matters is that the Richardson Dallas had this season is not a player who can help them in the way they need.

Your analysis could also apply to KP. Do you see that situation the same way?

(06-11-2021, 01:44 PM)Kammrath Wrote: [ -> ]Re: Josh Richardson and whether he opts in

I do not. He skipped exit interviews, right? To me that says he is LONG gone and cannot wait to be in another situation. 

He showed up for the exit interview conducted by the team, as did all the Mavs. He skipped the last-day media interview, along with a couple of others, I think Willie and Burke. It is actually not that uncommon for a team's free agents to pass on the media interview. I don't know if we can read anything particularly negative into it, but we can't interpret it as a good sign, either. 

I could see him opting in with the intention that the Mavs trade him somewhere that he and his agent like.

Until recently, I thought that Josh would probably not opt in, and that there would be a reasonable level of demand for him around the league if the Mavs wanted to pass. Now, I'm not so sure.

(06-12-2021, 03:49 PM)mavsluvr Wrote: [ -> ]Until recently, I thought that Josh would probably not opt in, and that there would be a reasonable level of demand for him around the league if the Mavs wanted to pass. Now, I'm not so sure.

I was pretty convinced until rather late in the season that he'd be able to get a 3 year MLE somewhere and would easily give up $2mm in 2021 to guarantee the additional $18mm.

Now, we need to figure out what, if any, team has a need for 1. an expiring JRich,  2. a need to make Bill Duffy happy, 3. has someone more highly paid than JRich that we might find useful, or 4. has a FA that they would rather not pay and would take some combo or players back that includes JRich.

I think there will be a team that wants him on a 1 yr so I am actually not to worried about it. We thought Delon Wright was total garbage and Detroit actually wanted him with 2 years left on his deal.

J Rich with the skins he has being a starter, still relatively young will have a taker. There just aren't enough good players and the expiring nature will help.

(06-12-2021, 07:06 PM)StepBackJay Wrote: [ -> ]I think there will be a team that wants him on a 1 yr so I am actually not to worried about it. We thought Delon Wright was total garbage and Detroit actually wanted him with 2 years left on his deal.

J Rich with the skins he has being a starter, still relatively young will have a taker. There just aren't enough good players and the expiring nature will help.

I think the worst case would be dumping him on a team that needs to hit the salary floor.

(06-12-2021, 07:06 PM)StepBackJay Wrote: [ -> ]I think there will be a team that wants him on a 1 yr so I am actually not to worried about it. We thought Delon Wright was total garbage and Detroit actually wanted him with 2 years left on his deal.

J Rich with the skins he has being a starter, still relatively young will have a taker. There just aren't enough good players and the expiring nature will help.

I think the better way to do this is find a direct exchange.  Yeah, we can pay a third team to be involved, but that will cost us something and make a deal more convoluted.  If the plan is to operate over the cap (and keep THJ and use the MLE), then we need the team the currently has the guy we want to also want JRich.  If we want to use cap room (and not keep THJ and not have the full MLE), then that is a different story.

(06-11-2021, 08:21 PM)Dahlsim Wrote: [ -> ]Agree, as an issue there's no denying it.  On that point I've always thought the style of play is a factor that is not often mentioned.   The other factor often not considered is who the BIG played with on the front line which determines a lot about the role he has to play on the floor. 

Dirk for instance had great longevity as a 7 footer not only because he took care of his body but also because his style of play, especially as he aged, did not require as much of the high flying jumping and impact on his joints, feet, knees etc. 

Being a jump shooter and conserving himself as an effective defender but not an all out throw you body around big, all played into is longevity. 

Tim Duncan. Another big man with great longevity and a Big Fundamental style of play that likely reduced the total number of high impacts to his legs, feet, knees. 

Shaq played 19 years, shifting his weight and knocking defenders around on his way to the HoF. 
I see a current guy like Brook Lopez at 13 years and still going strong having now converted a larger percentage of his offense to standing and shooting from the 3. Inside a lot of banging is absorbed by Giannis. 

I could see KP perhaps extending his body also if he can become a real sharpshooter at his height and size, and also by playing the 4 while big 5's like Boban or some other durable but skilled BIG absorbs a good % of the hits inside. 


Valid point again but I also go back to the point I made earlier.  Something people often miss with Dirk is how he was at his best and also protected often by having a strong BIG on the front line with him. 
Erick Dampier might have had scissors for hands but was big strong center, with a 15 year career and 6 in Dallas including going all the way to finals with Dirk. 
Then of course Dirk and Dallas had the 3-headed monster 5 rotation surrounding him the championship year with  Tyson Chandler/Brendan Haywood/Ian Mahinmi providing banging, rebounding, rim protection and just enough offense to free up Nowitzki to use his best talents and stay healthy on the floor.

Very interesting points. The ultra-tall stats regarding lack of durability actually referred to players taller than 7'1," but it seems that comparisons to seven-footers might still be apt. Also makes sense that playing style and playing patterns could affect longevity in big guys.

(06-11-2021, 09:38 PM)Dahlsim Wrote: [ -> ]Can't agree at all with singling out Boban & WCS as part of a turn south. 
Let's look at the facts: 
In fact Boban was DNPCD for the first half of series didn't start playing at all until after the Mavericks were completely controlled at home in Game 3 then were in fact getting completely crushed at home in Game 4.  

• Boban came into Game 4 and not only gave 12 pts and 6 reb. on 5 of 9 less than 15 min but also was the only Plus player on the entire roster with a +3.  
  
• In Game 5 Bobi 20 min 9 pts 7 reb, WCS only plays about 5 minutes and chips in a bucket and reb. Mavs win the game.  
  
• In pivotal Game 6 you have at last a case with WCS checking in at all 20 min of -13 time and for that matter Kleber over 20 min 0-4  of -13 .
  Boban checked in for 17min 12pt. 9 reb. for +5 2nd only of all Mavs to Brunson at +9 so he's hardly your problem there. In fact I could easily make the case that more of Boban/KP minutes in place of Kleber/WCS minutes could have changed the outcome of that game and given Dallas the series. 
  
• Game 7 was pretty much lost by Dallas being -10 on 3 pointers but again Bobi was 7 of 11 10 reb 3 ast. and his -1 was 2nd best only to DFS +1 for the game. 
  
  

Basically the turn big turn South was the only reason Carlisle went big and it did in fact slow the downturn and gave Dallas a chance to win.

Thanks for compiling these stats. Very thought-provoking!

(06-13-2021, 03:23 PM)mavsluvr Wrote: [ -> ]Very interesting points. The ultra-tall stats regarding lack of durability actually referred to players taller than 7'1," but it seems that comparisons to seven-footers might still be apt. Also makes sense that playing style and playing patterns could affect longevity in big guys.

I don't doubt that the Ultra tallness creates longevity concerns, wear and tear on the feet, bones, ligaments and just additional stress.  
I think its one factor though, not the entire picture.  

Obviously there is the weight and body structure but alsl the pure number of times a player is jumping, and the style of play in terms of the type of jumping, height etc. has to be relevant to the impact and total stress measurable over time on the areas that are known to cause problems in the big men. 

Not sure if there is a big line to be drawn between the 7 footer-ish big man and 7'1" + Big but there are clearly other factors in terms of injury and durability. 
As I said Shaq went 19 years but yet Greg Oden, "just" a 7 footer didn't lasted barely a 100 games over the course of less than 6 years. 

You have to also look at the player himself and how he cares for his body. 
Tim Duncan & Dirk had awesome longevity but Andrew Bynum came in strong only to flame out early, sticking around a few extra seasons stealing paychecks. He was evidently not exactly one to help his body out with his lifestyle.    The style of play is huge, the demands of the team based on who the player plays with is huge alongside obvious work ethic and diet. 
For that matter even Luka's longevity and risk worries me the way the Mavs are using him without enough star help to cary the load.  

Boban is interesting to me because he barely jumps to get a rebound, shoot or even dunk!  The impact there is much less than some other smaller big men.  

Porzingis on the other hand, at his height playing like a high flying small forward, or banging high minutes, jumping high (and landing), because he can, to block every shot and get every rebound at 5 against NBA strong men, yeah, he would worry me in some ways more than Marjanovic. 
Adjustments to his style of play could help reduce his risk I think.   If KP can be a real sharpshooter, those player can extend their careers at any size.

(06-13-2021, 03:31 PM)mavsluvr Wrote: [ -> ]Thanks for compiling these stats. Very thought-provoking!

Another way to look at those +/- stats is that Ty Lue and the Clippers emphasizing their best small team, not necessarily their smallest small team, allowed to essentially take Mavs #2 & #3 offensive players, THJ and Brunson, effectively out of the series.  The Clippers ended up playing relatively big skilled wings changing the dynamic from games 1 & 2 in LA. 

Brunson had sort of become the #3 and times even #2 behind Luka with THJ most often putting up a big game offensively. 
TJH I noticed stopped getting as many good looks from 3 and started taking tougher or longer 3's or trying to score inside the arc where he's meh, not at all elite. 

Its a case of small ball is fine as long as my small ball team is better than your small team.  Man for man the Mavs were most decidedly not better small vs small so Carlisle rightly went Big vs small.  Arguably the +/- suggest that he might have come closer to winning the series, esp. in Game 6 if he had really committed even more to that strategy in terms of both minutes and offensive distribution.