(05-21-2024, 03:58 PM)Chicagojk Wrote: I personally think Gafford is going to be a backup soon.  May not happen next year if this is working, but I think he is an elite backup center.  What is their price tag for a backup good center.  12-13 million?  I hope the mavs are proactive with resigning him before he gets to free agency.  At the very least, he has a reasonable contract that can be moved down the road.  Having two guys who are elite attacking the rim is one of the reasons why this has worked and clearly something Kidd wants.  I am in no hurry to break it up.

(05-21-2024, 04:04 PM)dirkfansince1998 Wrote: The main reason why I would hold onto Gafford is Lively's durability. Gafford seems like the kind of player that can give you 80 games. Lively's rookie season was almost Kleber-esque when it comes to minor injuries and him missing games. He only played 55 games.
Not the worst idea to have a backup that can also start 20 games per season.

(05-21-2024, 04:43 PM)Mavs2021 Wrote: Preach.

I still think they´ll trade Powell for a very minor asset. Stretch-waive THJ, if they can´t find a bigger deal involving Green or Kleber and just re-sign DJJ. Add a couple 2nd round picks and a young veteran and we are good to go. That should be do-able, while getting DJJ something like a 36-40/4-ish deal. 

Hard to tell what he´ll get offered. If somebody comes with a 60/4+ offer, the whole discussion is over anyway. Unless they think DJJ is so hard to replace that they spend a big asset (1st round pick) to flat out dump a THJ/Powell package.

(05-21-2024, 04:04 PM)dirkfansince1998 Wrote: The main reason why I would hold onto Gafford is Lively's durability. Gafford seems like the kind of player that can give you 80 games. Lively's rookie season was almost Kleber-esque when it comes to minor injuries and him missing games. He only played 55 games.
Not the worst idea to have a backup that can also start 20 games per season.

(05-21-2024, 03:34 PM)Moviemavguy Wrote: Gafford hasn't played well in the playoffs yet?  He averaged 11 pts, 7.5 rbds and 2 blocks on 61% shooting vs OKC. 

Good grief, I knew there was a reason I don't post here.  Just a bunch of nonsense.

(05-21-2024, 05:41 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: Gafford’s +/- was the worst on the team. Lively’s (his direct replacement) was the best. I don’t have time to find it right now because I’m on the go, but cumulatively in this past series, Lively was something like +71 and Gafford was like -65…those aren’t the exact numbers, because it’s from memory, but it was something along those crazy lines. 

What is it you think I’m missing?

(05-21-2024, 04:54 PM)Chicagojk Wrote: Yep, I wouldn’t even mind Gafford continuing to start next year.  At some point, Lively will be too good to come off the bench. 

(05-21-2024, 05:56 PM)DallasMaverick Wrote: The noise of a small sample size.

2 teams? 10-ish games?

It’s sort of like the bias against Timmy right now.  Look at his entire body of work, and it’s pretty decent.

(05-21-2024, 05:56 PM)DallasMaverick Wrote: The noise of a small sample size.

2 teams? 10-ish games?

It’s sort of like the bias against Timmy right now.  Look at his entire body of work, and it’s pretty decent.

(05-21-2024, 04:48 PM)Chicagojk Wrote: If the Mavs do the improbable and Jones continue to play well, there is a chance someone Bruce Brown’s him.  In that scenario, like Brown, jones needs to take the money.  I don’t know how many teams have money to burn this offseason at this point.  I don’t expect it to happen but if Jones continues to play well, it only takes one team

(05-21-2024, 03:53 PM)Knutsen Wrote: Two thoughts on this.

First, we could also try to dump Kleber to a team with cap space. I know, we love him and he‘s holding up the well-established German guy from Wurzburg tradition - which is a beautiful city about an hour away from me by the way - but in reality he doesn’t fit Luka‘s timeline and is far too unreliable from an injury perspective for the 11 million he costs us, for example compared to DJJ. That way we keep Hardaway‘s contract until the deadline, where it will reach it‘s highest trade value and could get us a nice asset from a team that changes from trying to win the championship to trying to win the lottery midseason.

Second, I feel exactly the same about Lively needing 30+ minutes to maximize his growth gradient. But what if he‘s coming back from the offseason ready to get 10 of those minutes at power forward next to Gafford in the role of Kleber? Similar to Wemby or Chet, who are sometimes playing the four, but without their ballhandling tasks and more in a stay in the corner and stretch the floor kind of role? Problem solved, you can play physical and athletic for 48 minutes at center with Gafford and Lively each getting 30 minutes per night.

(05-21-2024, 08:30 PM)Jakeospikez Wrote: Nah def don't trade Gafford. This team deserves the chance to mostly run it back with another year of development from the young players. Gafford doesn't have to invade on Lively's minutes, Lively starts next season. He's barely above MLE and if he's bad for whatever reason he just doesn't get played a lot that game. Lively had almost 30 mins in game 6. I wouldn't overreact to Gafford's playoff +/-, I'd rather say he's not playing optimally because of all of his injuries he's been dealing with. He almost broke Wilt's record and a ton of those fgs weren't dunks. His close range touch and scoring is elite. He has been missing a lot of those in the playoffs and based on what I saw I wouldn't say it's just the big matchup. If he comes off the bench he should be the one feasting on the other team's backup big as well. He can spot start or play heavier mins if the other bigs are out. Maxi doesn't have much tread on the tires left and he can't even play a ton in the regular season without breaking down so what are you gonna do? OMax would need to grow up quick or you trade for another Maxi type player. Also don't forget Gafford is young and still has room for growth. I'd look elsewhere to make room for DJJ.

(05-21-2024, 08:34 PM)mvossman Wrote: I don't see Lively every playing power forward.  If he can legit hit open 3's, then he will be a great alternative to Maxi for 5 out offense.  I think adding a traditional center to the mix would take away the offensive value and not really add anything to defense.

(05-21-2024, 08:34 PM)mvossman Wrote: Maxi would be more expensive to dump because he has two more years left and has no value to a rebuilding team.  He has more value to us than Timmy, while being more expensive to dump.  

I don't see Lively every playing power forward.  If he can legit hit open 3's, then he will be a great alternative to Maxi for 5 out offense.  I think adding a traditional center to the mix would take away the offensive value and not really add anything to defense.

(05-21-2024, 01:50 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: Unpopular post incoming:

If you want to save money right away for DJJ without giving up the deadline asset of Hardaway's expiring, I think dealing Gafford could be the answer.

He hasn't played well in the playoffs (yet), but he's still getting mentioned by the talking heads as a reason for the Mavs' strong finish. It's so beyond clear that Lively is the real reason for that, and Lively needs to be a 30 minutes per guy next year. Gafford gets paid too much for the type of role that's left over, because some (maybe a lot) of those other 18 minutes need to go to a Kleber type in order to stretch defenses, guard with more switching, etc - all the things we talk about here all the time.  But, you do need a Gafford TYPE around for the games Lively misses or the odd night he gets in foul trouble. You know, just in case. But again, Gafford, while obviously not in the same class as Lively, is better than THAT role, and certainly gets paid more than a guy in that role should.

So, is there a way the Mavs can A) move Gafford for less money returning (for DJJ purposes) while also B) picking up a good replacement for him at 3rd center at minimum or maybe BAE salary level, and MAYBE even C) recoup some draft capital along the way?

I would be open to that type of thing, personally. It would obviously require identifying the right guy (better than McGee, for example).

(05-22-2024, 03:01 AM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: Our center rotation just averaged 22 points and 22 boards a game to move us to the WCF and you want to break that up?  Our two headed monster at the center position is a strength and as currently constructed 

But, pretty clearly, 48 minutes of Gafford/Lively is also a viable strategy (in the ‘modern’ NBA).  Two successful playoff rounds show us that much more than some small sample size +/-.  Between Lively, Gafford, PJ, Maxi and OMax eventually replacing Maxi, we have a fantastic situation at C/PF.  I see no logic in breaking that up.  

I also don’t want to trade Green or Maxi.  THJ is the obvious candidate.  My preference there is to wait till the TDL and combine him with the 2025 pick.  But, there are two issues with that.  THJ continues to block Hardy and it would require DJJ take the TP MLE.  If we trade THJ this summer, I’d rather it be for a less expensive player.  This idea of getting nothing (or worse, paying to move him) is a bad idea.  There are too many potential opportunities with THJ to waste the asset just to clear space.