(05-18-2024, 03:12 PM)F Gump Wrote: Thybulle almost fits the 9-10M price range (11.025).

But THJ-for-____ in that 9-10M price range was never a guarantee of "any" competitive contract.

The fact is that ANY single trade with matching both ways will not open up huge money for DJJ, because the absolute biggest trade differential is $7.5M, and with the Mavs staring at being about $3M over the apron as is, plus needing some cushion (1M?) under the hard cap, that perfect 7.5M spread only adds maybe 3.5M, which means you're only bumping an offer to DJJ to a number under 9M.

THJ for MT at 11.025M is only a 5M spread, and almost all of that goes to cover the overage plus the cushion. It probably bumps the possible MLE up to about $6.25M.

(05-18-2024, 03:42 PM)Mavs2021 Wrote: I´m confused. Simons argument aside.

Thybulle has played 17 MPG over 25 career play-offs games. His career averages are 4/1/1/1/1. What exactly does Thybulle do, that Exum can´t? Has anyone watched these last 11 play-off games and thought: We need better defense? Does anyone worry about our defense tonight? No you worry where the offensive support will come from.

(05-19-2024, 05:40 AM)SleepingHero Wrote: Box score watching one of the most impactful perimeter defenders in the league is a pretty big mistake and might add to your confusion. He's the only guard since Jordan to average over 2 blocks a game adjusted for possessions more than once. Top 5 in steals per game for the league in 3 out of 5 years for his career (top 20 in his rookie year. tied for 21st last year where he got no minutes). All defensive twice in 5 years. 

His issue has always been his 3pt shot and scoring generally, but he's a highly athletic 6'5 forward with a streaky shot. Sound familiar? 

Contract wise, getability, and just general playstyle, Thybulle checks A LOT of boxes. And you should watch him sometime! Watching him lockdown players is very entertaining.

(05-19-2024, 05:33 AM)SleepingHero Wrote: To be fair, are we really expecting DJJ to be offered anywhere north of 9 mil a year? Don't get me wrong he's playing out of his mind right now on the biggest stage, but how many teams could DJJ play for and be this effective?

Who knows? He's said he wants to be back in the athletic article. I can't see a team offering more than the MLE at the absolute most in today's restricted NBA.

(05-19-2024, 07:39 AM)F Gump Wrote: I truly have no clue how much it will take to keep DJJ. His expectation is the key.

What I know (and both Mavs and DJJ know as well) is that the Mavs can certainly offer the following --
TxP MLE (5.2M) on a 1+1, which also gives him a full no trade
in 2025 offer up to NT MLE (maybe 13.5M or so?), perhaps another 1+1 and he again has full no-trade control
in 2026 he has full bird rights, to land at whatever is the right number for him to continue to complement Luka-Kyrie.

Would he do that? He's a great fit here.

On the other end, there's no scenario in which they can offer more than NT MLE of 12.9M this summer.

Also, getting the ability to do even increase the 5.2M this summer some of the way is possible, but uncertain, and most moves might not get the amount raised real far.

To get to the big MLE will be hard. To get part of the way will be more practical (like to the 8-9M area) but also perhaps costly).

On the flip side, he can very easily end up a player who gets paid so much that he's expected to do more than he can, and his team can't wait to get rid of him. He's been there before, and knows how that works.

So I suspect that if he really wants to be here, they have to work together on this - ie a cooperative venture to make sure he's okay and willing to sign the end result. Then the Mavs figure out how to do that.

(05-19-2024, 09:47 AM)Mavs2021 Wrote: 1. DJJ will not command more than the MLE.
2. Given his career earnings he cannot accept any deals that are less than 24/3 either. 
3. In his position his total matters more than his annual salary!
4. Whether such a trade is easily accomplished largely depends on the possibly heightened value of (semi) expiring contracts under the new CBA.
5. For example Bertans for THJ+Powell creates 15M in capspace after Bertans is waived. Question is how much do you have to pay for that: a couple 2nds, Hardy, O-Max, a protected 1st, an unprotected 1st?
6. Simons for THJ + Green + Powell opens an additional $6.9M, which might get you in range of DJJ 24/3. The good thing is that you can work with DJJ on these things before any trade.

My guess is that they´d like to keep most of the team together, but a deal involving Green might be easier to pull off. So this might partially come down to how much they value DJJ vs. Green.

(05-19-2024, 10:03 AM)DallasMaverick Wrote: He doesn’t strike me as a guy with a big ego. Not Latrell Sprewell.

(05-19-2024, 10:17 AM)BigDirk41 Wrote: I think DJJ will absolutely want to stay, but it may take 4/40 to 4/50 to keep him, but I think they have to do it. Him and PJ are so versatile and important to the defense and they are even knocking down 3s now. We need to create the space somehow to keep him. He seems to have some of the clutch gene in him too. You can't teach that.

(05-19-2024, 11:28 AM)Scott41theMavs Wrote: Nowhere near possible for the Mavs under the CBA, which is the real topic of conversation here.

(05-17-2024, 11:50 PM)Luka77 Wrote: THJ, Powell, Hardy, 25' first

For 

Anthony Simons

(05-19-2024, 12:04 PM)Jym Wrote: Going to take some maneuvering but we're not THAT far from making the numbers work right? Is there something I'm missing? I don't get why people act like we have to dump THJ fully into space. 

If we pick up Exum's 3 mil, then we'll have 12 players under contract at 171 mil

Tax line will be 172 mil and that first apron will be at 179 mil

Need to figure out a good way for us to have 13 players under contract with a payroll around $168 mil to $171 mil

(05-19-2024, 12:33 PM)Jym Wrote: What's stopping us from sending out Timmy's $16.2 mil and getting back 2 players who make around $11 mil combined?
That would let us give DJJ up to the full mle and give us space to maybe do a 15th guy if he takes less


Edit
I forgot about AJ Lawson.
On the books for 2.1 mil next season but his contract isn't guaranteed

(05-19-2024, 12:33 PM)Jym Wrote: What's stopping us from sending out Timmy's $16.2 mil and getting back 2 players who make around $11 mil combined?
That would let us give DJJ up to the full mle and give us space to maybe do a 15th guy if he takes less


Edit
I forgot about AJ Lawson.
On the books for 2.1 mil next season but his contract isn't guaranteed

(05-19-2024, 12:40 PM)mvossman Wrote: I think Gump did the math and a best case Timmy trade only gets us to about 8 mil.  He could probably show the details.  He is rarely wrong on this kind of stuff.

(05-19-2024, 12:47 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: Easy in theory, because I assume what you mean by “what’s stopping us“ is that you are willing to take back a very low level of player to accomplish the financial goal. That kind of thing has been fairly easy in the past.

The issue now is that many, many teams will hit the off-season with the same goal of reducing payroll in order to accomplish what they are trying to accomplish without incurring excessive cap penalties. So, many of the would-be trade partners will also be insisting that THEY take back less salary than they send out. There are teams with cap space and not all of them will find free agents on which they are willing to spend it, but the teams who are in position to absorb someone like Hardaway as a favor for the Mavericks, even in just in a lopsided, still sending some money out kind of deal, will expect value for doing so. 

The reality is none of us really know what to expect over the next couple of summers, including most of the dudes who work in these front offices.

I will be satisfied with the off-season if the Mavericks are able to maneuver enough to retain DJJ and MAYBE add one minimum who can hopefully contribute, similar to Exum/DJJ last summer. I feel like we have arrived at a place where that amount of work constitutes a successful off-season. Anything past that is gravy, and it might be more difficult to accomplish those things then we understand sitting here now.

(05-19-2024, 12:49 PM)Jym Wrote: Best case here would be completely dumping THJ? 
Maybe he was wanting to stay completely under the tax to avoid repeater tax stuff